Definitions

[MaryW]

This drives me batty!


Alternative lifestyle: a lifestyle outside of the cultural norm
This can include gays, hippies, punks, and swingers

Swinger: a subculture of the alternatives lifestyle.
This can include soft swap, full swap, voyeurism, exhibitionism, forplay, sensual touching, group sex, closed swap, open swap, oral swap, etc.

If you go to Hedo KNOWING what the Hedo lifestyle is about and you are in full acceptance of what goes on there you ARE participating in the lifestyle.
(No doubt some people wind up there NOT knowing what to expect and still others get there and say "this is not for me")

What you do when you are at Hedo determines what swinging subculture you participate in....soft swap, full swap, voyeurism, exhitionism, etc.

Whether you decide to participate or not during any given week doesn't change what you are or what you believe. If I go to Catholic church but choose not to take communion this week, does that mean I'm not Catholic?

I understand that many people still believe that swinging means swapping...but it doesn't any longer with the new age of "soft swingers".

Sensually kissing someone else is no different than having intercourse with someone else in terms of defining alternative lifestyle.

For those who don't agree...if you talked to someone who said I'm not a swinger because I only f*ck other people when I'm at Hedo what would you think of that?

So a woman who enjoys kissing or touching other women, even if it's ONLY when she's at Hedo she is bi.

A couple who considers it normal for someone to be receiving a blow job on the edge of the pool next to them while they enjoy a plate of nachos is part of an alternative lifestyle.

[Mars & Venus]

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[miamivice69]

I agree with most of what you said, but I do not agree that voyeurism and exhibitionism fall within the definition of “swinger.” They may fall within the definition of alternative life style but not swinging. IMO swinging involves and couple is some type of committed relationship engaging in sexual activity with another or others. Sexual activity can be anything from kissing to intercourse.

The term that gets me is bi-curious which is common on lifestyle sites. You are bi-curious if you wonder want it would be like to have sex with someone but have never done it. Sorry ladies but if you have gone down on a woman and are willing to do it again, you have more past curious.

[miamivice69]

Excellent post M&V

[Mars & Venus]

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[2fast]

That just invites all kinds of other speculations about terms and taxonomy.

What if you're just a little curious?
What if you're really, really, REALLY curious but you never act on it?
What if you "head south" but decide you don't like it?
What if you (as a guy) do fellatio but he doesn't cum?
What if a guy does oral with another guy but doesn't take him analy?
How many times do you get to "try it out" before you're bisexual vs. bicurious?
Do you have to enjoy it to qualify?
What if you really, really, REALLY enjoy it? Are you now Gay or Lesbian instead of Bi?
What if you only do it in Hedo? (see below)

Hence the problem with terms in the complicated world of sexual relations.

Those questions are easy, if one were asked my answers would be:
What if you're just a little curious?bi curious
What if you're really, really, REALLY curious but you never act on it?Bi- curious
What if you "head south" but decide you don't like it? Not Bi
What if you (as a guy) do fellatio but he doesn't cum? bi or gay
What if a guy does oral with another guy but doesn't take him analy?bi or gay

How many times do you get to "try it out" before you're bisexual vs. bicurious? 1 or 2 depending on circumstances
Do you have to enjoy it to qualify? if the thought of being with another person of the same sex isn't put out of your mnd when you try it I believe enjoying the single act isn't required

What if you really, really, REALLY enjoy it? Are you now Gay or Lesbian instead of Bi? If you still are attracted to the opposite sex you'd be bi

All that being said, I don't believe in labels too much. I think it's possible to have penis' touch without being gay or bi. I think it's possible for 2 hetro ladies to kiss.
I guess every label has it's exceptions.
Are kel and I swingers? Yeah, I guess but dislike the term, not sure why.
Lifestylers in the sexual sense? definitely
Bi? Kel is, I'm not
Bi curious? Nope


One of Kel's favorite sayings is "bi curious? let me enlighten you."

Guess we'll see if we're ready for Hedo in 3 days. I'm a bit more worried Hedo won't be ready for us..lol

[MaryW]

The only problem I see with that attitude is when it becomes so prevalent that newbies or those that really shouldn't be swinging at all, fall victim (and I do mean "victim") to what can happen at Hedo. It's intellectual dishonesty (like double-standards) that can be dangerous--for some.

So true and very well put. This is important!

One of Kel's favorite sayings is "bi curious? let me enlighten you."

Love it!

How many times do you get to "try it out" before you're bisexual vs. bicurious?

That may just depend on whether you met the "right" person or not!


As for the bi-topic...We have coined a few phrases:

Bi-Pending: In many cases, bi-curious is really bi-pending: if you've fantasized about it, you're probably really bi you just haven't done it yet.

Bi-tolerant: you really aren't turned on by it but you're not grossed out so you do it for the fun of it or for the sake of your spouse.

I think I mentioned this on here before but I met a guy once who described himself as "Bi-oral"

Haven't come up with a term for those who like to touch and kiss but dont want to go down on the other person.

[MaryW]

Thanks for the visual....I'll never get cheese on my nachos again!!!

Was that cheese?????

[Mars & Venus]

redacted

[MaryW]

It's not so much the accuracy of the labels that drives me crazy but the undertone that being considered a swinger is a bad thing or being in the lifestyle is undesirable.

M&V...that's definitely an interesting scenario! It can happen too...I know some guys would freak and others would say what the heck.

[phenixkitty]

I'm courious as to what people consider themselves so I don't o-fend but I'm not hung up on terms ....especially at Hedo----go without expectations of any kind!

I don't consider myself "bi" but if a hot chic and I find some common ground in what ever way...so be it-----but I'd say I'm just as picky about females as I am about men!!! C'mon, hot is hot but it's a personality or funny attitude, smart comments or friendly manner that is attractive----you wanna call me bi----fine, but I don't call myself bi. I'm just open to hot, fun, attractive people with outstanding personalities........and at Hedo---I'm open to whatever with those kind of people.....does that make me bi in denial?? LOL

[hare2party]

A couple who considers it normal for someone to be receiving a blow job on the edge of the pool next to them while they enjoy a plate of nachos is part of an alternative lifestyle.

Damn I love those nachos. They can do whatever they want as long as they don't splash water on my nachos.

[Spinx Haplo]

And the nachos must have chicken, chili and be made by John!!!

[SouthernFried]

How about we all just say we are Hedonists ?!? LOL

I agree with Mary W -- with labels comes a certain sense of stigma and for some that is a problem...for me personally, I don't care, noone can make me feel bad about me without my consent!

Peace, Love and Hedo for all !

[S&C]

So it sounds like some of us in the lifestyle are higher up on Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.

I for one am still on the bottom rung...well maybe a little higher, but not yet on top (well sometimes

1. Physiological Needs
These include the most basic needs that are vital to survival, such as the need for water, air, , food and sleep. Maslow believed that these needs are the most basic and instinctive needs in the hierarchy because all needs become secondary until these physiological needs are met.

2. Security Needs
These include needs for safety and security. Security needs are important for survival, but they are not as demanding as the physiological needs. Examples of security needs include a desire for steady employment, health insurance, safe neighborhoods and shelter from the environment.

3. Social Needs
These include needs for belonging, love and affection. Maslow considered these needs to be less basic than physiological and security needs. Relationships such as friendships, romantic attachments and families help fulfill this need for companionship and acceptance, as does involvement in social, community or religious groups.

4. Esteem Needs
After the first three needs have been satisfied, esteem needs becomes increasingly important. These include the need for things that reflect on self-esteem, personal worth, social recognition and accomplishment.

5. Self-actualizing Needs
This is the highest level of Maslow’s hierarchy of needs. Self-actualizing people are self-aware, concerned with personal growth, less concerned with the opinions of others and interested fulfilling their potential.